Tim and Jerry's Experimental BlogRight to exist?
Here Tim and Jerry discuss the death penalty, assisted suicide, and other sunny topics.
Do we really have the right to exist, and if we do can we give that right away. I was thinking about Zacarias Moussaoui the terrorist that pleaded guilty to plotting to kill 3000 people in the World Trade Center and the Pentagon and wherever else. Unabashedly proclaiming he did it and he would do it again. Does his lack of care for the right for others to exist negate his right to exist? After all if he did not feel obligated to devote any fealty for someone else’s right to exist does that mean he does not believe in the right to exist, and in doing so does that not mean he would even care if anyone allowed him the same right?
Herein is the reality of how I view the issue: The bullets cannot travel fast enough to the brain of Zacarias Moussaoui. He gave up the right to exist the moment he declared killing 3,000 people to be a worthy task. (By the way, that is a more horrific task than appears on the surface familial losses, and the anguish, and the pain, and the scars, and the…)
Jerry, do you read what you write? A person gives up his "right to exist" by saying that killing someone is a worthy task? You don't have to actually kill someone, but just saying it's a worthy task is now enough to secure the death penalty? Surely you jest!
No jesting here. The man planned, assisted, and bragged. The man who gives the gun to a murderer knowing he will commit the crime is just as guilty. Also he still declares it a thing worth doing and would do it again. The man is a rabid dog. He needs to be put down. In minimizing his role you tacitly endorse his horrific crime.
There is no crime in bragging of course, but IF the man planned and assisted, I agree with you. I'm surprised that you seem to know so much. Do you know this man personally? Have you received your subpoena to testify, since you are obviously an expert witness?
Don't you believe in "due process"? Taking a man's life as punishment for a crime has got to be the last resort. It cannot be done lightly or quickly, as there is no appeal.
This Zacarias Moussaoui may indeed be worthy of the death penalty, but not unless it can be proven that he actually killed someone. Planning to kill someone does not get you the death penalty. Saying it would be a good idea to kill someone does not get you the death penalty. That's why we have a criminal justice system, and "rule of law". We don't just put a bullet in a man's brain because we don't think he's a good guy. We don't put a bullet in a man's brain even if we know he's a terrible guy who wants to kill people, and would do so given the chance. That's sometimes frustrating, but it's very important.
As I understand it, the effort to secure the death penalty for Mr. Moussaoui has to do with proving that, had he told the whole truth to some FBI agents during a interrogation prior to 9/11, they could have prevented the attacks. If he did not have information which could have prevented the attacks -- in other words, he was the al-Queda equivalent of an uninformed lackey who just wanted to be a big-wig -- then he is not really guilty of anything worthy of death. He's a bad guy to be sure, even an awful, horrible guy, but being those things is not enough to get you the death penalty.
Now I will expostulate an even harder question. If a person believes in the right to exist, can they also relinquish the right to exist? A person in deep, deep pain who feels it beyond their ability to live a life worth the effort; can they give up the right to exist?
Yes, it's called suicide. People give up their right to live every day in this way, so that certainly answers the question of whether it can be done. I think your real question is, do people have an obligation to go on living as long as possible, no matter what. That's the hard question behind all this "assisted suicide" business.
For the people who want to relieve themselves of the burden of life I yield to a more knowing person. I will say, however; hope is the thing. If you have no hope, you may have an argument. If you have hope, hang in there baby.
Do we really have the right to exist, and if we do can we give that right away. I was thinking about Zacarias Moussaoui the terrorist that pleaded guilty to plotting to kill 3000 people in the World Trade Center and the Pentagon and wherever else. Unabashedly proclaiming he did it and he would do it again. Does his lack of care for the right for others to exist negate his right to exist? After all if he did not feel obligated to devote any fealty for someone else’s right to exist does that mean he does not believe in the right to exist, and in doing so does that not mean he would even care if anyone allowed him the same right?
Herein is the reality of how I view the issue: The bullets cannot travel fast enough to the brain of Zacarias Moussaoui. He gave up the right to exist the moment he declared killing 3,000 people to be a worthy task. (By the way, that is a more horrific task than appears on the surface familial losses, and the anguish, and the pain, and the scars, and the…)
Jerry, do you read what you write? A person gives up his "right to exist" by saying that killing someone is a worthy task? You don't have to actually kill someone, but just saying it's a worthy task is now enough to secure the death penalty? Surely you jest!
No jesting here. The man planned, assisted, and bragged. The man who gives the gun to a murderer knowing he will commit the crime is just as guilty. Also he still declares it a thing worth doing and would do it again. The man is a rabid dog. He needs to be put down. In minimizing his role you tacitly endorse his horrific crime.
There is no crime in bragging of course, but IF the man planned and assisted, I agree with you. I'm surprised that you seem to know so much. Do you know this man personally? Have you received your subpoena to testify, since you are obviously an expert witness?
Don't you believe in "due process"? Taking a man's life as punishment for a crime has got to be the last resort. It cannot be done lightly or quickly, as there is no appeal.
This Zacarias Moussaoui may indeed be worthy of the death penalty, but not unless it can be proven that he actually killed someone. Planning to kill someone does not get you the death penalty. Saying it would be a good idea to kill someone does not get you the death penalty. That's why we have a criminal justice system, and "rule of law". We don't just put a bullet in a man's brain because we don't think he's a good guy. We don't put a bullet in a man's brain even if we know he's a terrible guy who wants to kill people, and would do so given the chance. That's sometimes frustrating, but it's very important.
As I understand it, the effort to secure the death penalty for Mr. Moussaoui has to do with proving that, had he told the whole truth to some FBI agents during a interrogation prior to 9/11, they could have prevented the attacks. If he did not have information which could have prevented the attacks -- in other words, he was the al-Queda equivalent of an uninformed lackey who just wanted to be a big-wig -- then he is not really guilty of anything worthy of death. He's a bad guy to be sure, even an awful, horrible guy, but being those things is not enough to get you the death penalty.
Now I will expostulate an even harder question. If a person believes in the right to exist, can they also relinquish the right to exist? A person in deep, deep pain who feels it beyond their ability to live a life worth the effort; can they give up the right to exist?
Yes, it's called suicide. People give up their right to live every day in this way, so that certainly answers the question of whether it can be done. I think your real question is, do people have an obligation to go on living as long as possible, no matter what. That's the hard question behind all this "assisted suicide" business.
For the people who want to relieve themselves of the burden of life I yield to a more knowing person. I will say, however; hope is the thing. If you have no hope, you may have an argument. If you have hope, hang in there baby.
By "a more knowing person" I assume you are referring to myself, and thanks for the compliment. It's about time you came to this realization!
How do you get your head through the door?
So are you in favor of legislation to legalize assisted suicide? I would be surprised to hear that!
I think I would never presume to endorse assisted suicide, I have many more issues with this issue than what I have written here. Life is too precious to waste.
Hope is such a hard thing to measure. When someone is just low on hope, it can seem like there is none at all. If I had jumped off a bridge every time I thought all hope was gone, I'd be dead several times by now. Looking back on those times I can see now that hope was just ebbing, or maybe a little farther away than usual, but never gone. "While there's life, there's hope" as the old saying goes. Or like Captain Taggart says: "Never give up! Never surrender!"
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